Fuel is delivered based on throttle plate position and engine RPM, and the computer reads the manifold vacuum and controls fuel accordingly. Over the years, improvements in the PCM and the software running the PCM have increased the level of communication and the amount of data acquisition. When I had my Cobra in for warranty service back in '99 the dealership had in the garage a 4.6L-32V Crown Vic from Ford. Ive honestly always thought the same thing. REENADED . (Photo Courtesy SCT). VCT and the improved PATS system make using the factory wiring more difficult in most cases. Ford also has used some creative routing for some of the wires, requiring you to get all the wiring harnesses from your donor car. 1929 wheat penny. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. An old swing-arm voltmeter could be used to read the pulses put out by the computer. Trying to put 3V heads on your 2V block sounds like a recipe for endless headaches. The PATS II looked at the serial numbers of certain components such as the gauge cluster and wouldnt start if they had been changed. (Photo Courtesy Classic Resto Garage). The computer can tell you more about what is happening with the engine than any external device. 2005 Cadillac CTS-V. - '96 Cobra 13.45 at 104.458 mph. The 2003 Cobra engine puts out 390 hp in stock form. If you get a 3V computer, you can run the VVT and shut up these nay-sayers. The jump to EEC-VI and improvements such as drive-by-wire technology and Variable Cam Timing (VCT) came in 2005. they actually have forum users that don't talk **** and are friendly to people. existing tank, you need to reprogram the computer to tell the fuel pump circuit to maximize output all the time and run an old-style regulator and return line to the tank. This allows a scanner to access the analog and digital sensors that are controlled by the PCM. 5.7 Hemi, 8 speed ZF trans 3.06 open rear 13.98 @ 99.2 mph 4740 lbs with driver!! Ford used speed density on engines from 1986 to mid-1989, when they converted to mass air systems. The engine bay needs to be modified to make room for the bigger engine. Archive - Wouldn't it be possible to tap into the ECU and make it functional? PATS It would also open you up to a newer style intake manifold. The small compact size makes it handy when traveling (e.g., if you want to carry different tunes for different grades of gas), and it can be licensed to tune more than one vehicle, so no need for a separate tuner for each of your rides. Fatstang you didnt have to get your pistons notched? I meant the other way around, why can't the pcm my car came with be reprogrammed to manage the new motor? I was just going to have a cam sprocket machined for the driver cam with the pip on it, a crank trigger wheel for the front and just use the engine harness PCM and sensors from the 4.6l that originally came in the car. I thought it would be much simpler to use the 4.6l harness and use all of the sensors and stuff that way I can keep everything simple and straight forward that way all I had to do was have the PCM tuned/flashed for the bigger motor. Most MAF systems use sequential fuel injection, which means the fuel injectors are only firing once per cycle, making them more efficient than some speed density systems that fire every revolution (also called waste spark). Paul him self told me he used the factory 4.6l 3v PCM took awhile to tune right and spliced the 6.2l harness to the 4.6l harness. Retaining the original computer and harness for your engine type is simpler and easier than using an aftermarket computer because you can use the factory plugs and the original wiring and sensors. Long blocks seem to be the same, as usual since Ford likes to stamp out the same thing to put in as many vehicles as possible. . 4v? This is more of a two-way communication with your computer, and the computer can respond to your inquiries and perform tests for you. In a nut shell, not all 4.6L engines are built the same. For Ford F100 F-100 Crown Vic Steel Front Pair Suspension Swap bracket kit. Or swap out for a 4.6 3v? You may also have to move pins within connectors if you have mismatched harnesses, or if you are trying to combine harness connectors. Only car that came with more than two valves was the Marauder which had a 4v. That means that the suspension geometry and ride quality is designed for this truck. i bought a 6.2l short block and heads for it. im interested in get some info for you ill be back, no the 6.2l is a 2v. open to all modifications to the 5 . Its about 11:1. If it's a 3 valve it will be straight. Ford tends to route wires through multiple harnesses, so you need them all, and depending on the year, youll need items such as fuel pumps and controllers, perhaps even components you wont be using. Free shipping. A Crown Victoria engine and a Mustang engine may have the same connector, but Ford changes the pinouts of the wires in the connector. We'll send you raw engine tech articles, news, features, and videos every week from EngineLabs. The pcm wont let the engine ping. The 20032004 Cobra Terminator engines continue to be a popular swap engine because they are easy to modify and produce a lot of power. Factory Computers with Aftermarket Wiring Harnesses. I will PM you my user name and forum. Regular price $220 View. Basically this thread is only about a higher compression engine wich usually net a 15% gain for a full point of compression bump so we are even farther in hp gain than we expected with the 3v heads swap. These cars never came with a 3v. I like the idea of a 3v over a coyote because I like how people **** on 3v's now that the coyotes came out but its still a great motor with less displacement and headflow. The TorqShift is A LOT larger. The first generation of the Modular V8, to be more precise, a 4.6-liter engine with fuel injection from a Crown Victoria body-on-frame sedan. However, a simple software jump in the PCM programming could defeat these systems. Go here to check out what weve been up to. Anything that can affect what the computer thinks it is seeing needs to be addressed. Through the years, numerous companies have attempted to build harnesses, and I have tried many of them, with varying degrees of success. Currently, the best choice for operating the Coyote engine and later engines with VCT is the Ford Performance Control Pack. The computer could also run checks on the sensors in Key On Engine Running (KOER) mode. Of course my fantasy build is a V10/Fox-bodied Mustang with a manual trans (T56?). Some of these systems are best controlled using a factory computer. I really wanted to do the swap in an sn95 because a full bolt on 3v in the lighter sn95 chassis with a good suspension would be a nice strip car. A forum community dedicated to Mustang and Ford Performance owners and enthusiasts. The PCM controls the voltage applied to the pump and reads the pressure via a pressure transducer mounted on the fuel rail. The 4.6 mustang makes 300. idk really. The next step up is the ability to read the data stored in the computer and the ability to perform specific tests on certain items controlled by the PCM. Ford also changes the wire locations in the connectors. If you liked this article you will LOVE the full book. Out the factory door, the P71 Interceptor Crown Vic managed 239 horsepower out of its 4.6 liter V8. It,s not super fast as per todays standart but considering the weight of our car the low end torque production of the 5.4 makes our car a ton more fun to drive. For the 2005 to 2009 Ford Mustang 3-Valve 4.6 V8 Modular Engine with manual transmission, they have you covered here as well. From 0cc to -20cc dish piston, if your cams (aftermarket) have too much duration/lift is when notche. Some of these systems cannot be used in pollution-controlled vehicles. (something different) i have welded my rear doors shut and i shaved the rear door handles, the car looks realy good it has a real nice lean look and the stance with factory suspension looks fantastic. Follow the recommendations in this chapter to select the best computer and wiring system for your engine. There are so many conflicting opinions Do I get the 5.4 2v? One of the most popular swaps going these days is underpinning various classic trucks with the front suspension off of the venerable Ford Crown Victoria, including the 1967-1972 Ford F-100. A Lokar throttle cable is used along with an accelerator pedal from a 1970 Mustang to run the throttle body. There are low profile aftermarket aluminum manifolds for . This also allowed the T-56 shifter to protrude into the original shifter hole without any modifications. Many aftermarket computers cannot control the variable timing, and the camshafts have to be locked down. Even the earliest EEC-IV computers could communicate running information and errors incurred. Come join the discussion about performance, racing, builds, modifications, troubleshooting, maintenance, and more! JavaScript is disabled. Keep us posted if you go for it! She is rust free but does have minor exterior hail damage and could use a paint job. Others can get the connectors, and some use a central junction point that permits remote mounting, but it is big and bulky. It can be set up for a factory returnless fuel system or an aftermarket fuel pump with return line. Brand New. $62.50. checkout some of the project updates, theres about 3-4 in there that people have Would also like to add AC to the truck as well if the makes a difference. I think the only real issue is with one of the bolts on the timing cover not lining up properly, as you'll need to use your current timing cover. Buy It Now. this is the GRM forum where small engines rule, so i'll be the one to suggest the turbo 2.3/T5 combo from the Thunderbird Turbocoupe. 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The original Bosch intercooler pump is mounted on the underside of the original battery tray. i called around asking about what computer i should use, i have been told to use the FRPP 3.V kit for the 6.2 in my crown vic and have it calibrated for my engine, the heads will be stock no cnc work. Buying every sensor or component from Ford can be very expensive. With the 4.6L swap you are going to need to make motor mounts or purchase some aftermarket ones, get a high pressure fuel pump and all the plumbing that goes with it, an external transmission cooler as the one in the radiator is not good enough for the AODE/4R70W/4R75W family of transmission, a remote oil filter base as the current filter will Ford made constant improvements to the engines and controls throughout the years, and along with the base computer, the control systems also changed. A 5.4 should bolt in right in place of the 4.6. crown vic 3v swapcapricorn and virgo flirting. From what I've read, some of the changes to the Panther suspension in '03 were to fit the quad cam 4.6 in the Marauder. Why not just use a 3v + manual + pcm out of a mustang? 96 F150 5.0 Firing OrderFiring order 1996 ford f-150 5. JavaScript is disabled. MM sells them. Make sure that the system you choose is legal. But it may prove more challenging as Ford continues to improve its security systems. Paul did tell me that it took awhile to tune the PCM from the mustang and he spliced a stock 6.2l and 4.6l 3v harness together. The third level of communication allows you to reprogram your computer system, and this is what you need to get around systems such as PATS. _____ Best time 13.079 @ 105 1.8 60 . For a nice primer on hopping-up Mod Motors from our sister publication EngineLabs, go here. The V-10 has 2 places for the motor mounts to bolt to and we moved motor mount to other position and it bolted in the crown vic clip. Put both motors on an engine stand. That is the main reason I was wondering about the feasability of the SOHC 3v. The only real advantage the automatic has over a manual is driveability for extreme stop and go traffic and starting uphill, but with careful footwork it's not a big deal with a manual. I am just wondering if it makes any noticeable difference. many people have done the 54. lightning swap also. Seems like alot less hassle. So a freer breathing head would make more horsepower, and the 5.4's added displacement can still keep intake velocity up at lower RPMs, which is where torque is made. To get the pro/street look the factory fender flares have been widened 112 inches in the back and 1 inch in the front. Renegade Race Engines 4.6 SOHC: Cobra Crank, Manley Rods, Custom coated Diamond Pistons >10.5:1 cr w/valve reliefs, PnP npi heads, Comp Cams, 70mm TB, Maurader Intake Assembly w/80mmMAF, 24# inj, Walbro 190lph, FRPP shortys, custom 2.25 dual exh, SCT Xcal2, Dirtyd0g TC; RoadmasterTranz Police Duty 4R70W (mild J-mod). The car has received a mini tub in the back and all four fenders have been flared 112 inches. valve train. Generated in 0.029 seconds in which 0.014 seconds were spent on a total of 16 queries. I don't see why it would be endless headaches. I know this is for trucks but I would really like to see how this turns out. The factory supercharged 2003 Cobra engine uses a special dual fuel pump to handle the extra fuel needs. harness all at once. 5.4s were made (in my opinion) to have 4V heads on them (or TFS heads, now go finish your build bondfreak!) Ford F-100 Crown Vic Front Suspension Swap. I think the cams are the same but I could be wrong and yea its not plug and play but its an easy swap. Team321 offers this setup in two packages: the base package includes the crossmember, upper control arms, all mounting hardware and sway bar; the complete suspension package adds the lower control arms, steering rack, coilovers, knuckles, steering tie rods and sway bar links. so if they are canceling the variable timing it will make less than 300 hp, the variable timing is the key to make 300 hp . Whats The Reason Enthusiasts Cant Get, Quicksilvers Crate Engine Program: Past, Present, And The, PRI 2022: FuelTech Talks About The Tech Of The FT700, PRI 2022: Concept Performance Now Offers Aluminum LTR, PRI 2022: Wiseco And K1 Launch 7.3L Godzilla Rod/Piston, SEMA 2022: Hedman Shows First-Gen F-Body LT V8 Swap, SEMA 2022: Adult Legos Trick Tools Icengineworks Modeling, Full Factory Tour: How Edelbrock Makes Its Cast Aluminum, High-Performance Racing Fasteners: How ARP Fasteners Are, Ford vs Chevy Comparison Size, Weight, and HP Per, Video: How To Install COMP Cams LS Rocker Arm Trunion Upgrade, Ford Mustang 3-Valve 4.6 V8 Modular Engine with manual transmission. the 6.2l uses different sensors for the crank and cam pick-ups then what the 4.6l 2v uses. WIth the mechanical work wrapped in the shop, Matt strapped her down to the rollers to get dialed in by Vlad via HP Tuners. Dave Cruikshank is a lifelong car enthusiast and an Editor at Power Automedia. Not unpossible just gigantic enough to make the "Street Rod" standalone PCM far worth the $1100. But as of now it's guesstamates and math, until some one does it. While many industry names have been used to describe the computer that controls the engine, Ford refers to its system as the Powertrain Control Module or PCM. Please post pics, because I for one would love to have a V10 powered car someday. why not use the computer and harness from the 6.2? Sounds neat, i wonder what it'd get for mpg being in something a little lighter and more aerodynamic haha. The air conditioning is adapted to the original 1967 A/C box. The 2003+ Ford Crown Victoria has become a popular chassis swap donor for older vehicles, especially pick-up trucks for several reasons: First, starting in 2003, the full-sized fords (Crown Victoria, Mercury Grand Marquis, and Lincoln Town Car) all had rack-and-pinion steering and a coil-over style spring and shock assembly. MASSIVE issues to get that to work in a non OEM install. This wiring kit comes with all of the sensor connections pre-installed on color-coded and printed wire which attaches to the engine and transmission using the factory ECM. About Us - The latest systems cannot only give you the basic error codes, but can log information on the engine and systems when an error occurs, provide real-time running information on the performance of the engine, and be programmed over the Internet for engine and drivetrain improvements for both performance and efficiency. 3v conversion is not possible at the time, the junkyard already sold the pcm and wiring harness. A typical vintage muscle car had 5 to 10 fused circuits. Ford implemented the EEC-V computer to comply with the mandated On Board Diagnostic II (OBDII) industry standard. Wiring the system is the most difficult part of any swap, and with all the changes Ford has made over the years and the upgrades to computers, it is a source of apprehension to most builders. You should search Ceatus McFarland (spelling may be wrong) on YouTube he has a crown vic with a GT500 engine in it and swapped it himself. :dumb: I resisted the urge to go "what the f would you want to do this for? The HPT Tuner Suite puts the power of a professional tuning shop on your home PC. With 390 hp, the 20032004 Terminator engines continue to be a popular option when making a modular engine conversion. The PCM harness comes out through the side panel and into the passengers side through the corner firewall. Some manufacturers still use speed density. how ever I have all of my parts for the engine. Ford has used at least four different computer systems to control the modular engines. Most error codes are for emissions systems, but there are codes assigned to manufacturer specific problems. I run a shortblock from a 07 3v with 44cc TFS 2V Heads. and used safety glass to fill in the rear windows. A mass airflow system features a meter mounted ahead of the throttle plate that measures the amount of air going into the engine. I have been trolling the auctions and I am looking to pick-up a Crown Vic Cop Car. Plus he's saying your dynamic compression ratio will be changed to the point where you probably wont be able to use your stock cams but someone else can explain that better than I could. Read this over, has all the info needed, use your stock 4.6 mounts. All of these systems were the mass airflow type and used coil packs (modular engines do not use a distributor). A simple error code reader can be had for little cost at most auto parts stores. but i have a few issues. The other thing regardless of the swap is the wiring harness. (something different) i have welded my rear doors shut and i shaved the rear door handles, the car looks realy good it has a real nice lean look and the stance with factory suspension looks fantastic. Using the 2003 Cobra hydroboost also aids in moving the engine back to the firewall. #3. If you want to drop a Blue Oval Mod Motor into your Mustang, T-Bird, or Rod and keep it all FoMoCo, Ron Francis Wiring has you covered. The biggest challenges to installing the engine are the width and height. I will have a cam sprocket made for the driver side cam with the pip and a crank timing gear so I can use the crank trigger and cam sensor. (A friend test drove a newer Mustang GT and while he was cruising at 95 mph and backup system threw a minor code. Make the donor look like the original (electrically). I've found a diagram for using the f100 ignition. Try to find the whole truck so you get the motor, trans and elec. But I just mentioned that 3V uses a different intake, of which several high-performance models exist. Now I want to put a V10 in for fun. "We also offer complete wiring systems for the 2005 to 2009 Mustang GT 3-valve 4.6 engine and manual transmission." They have an automatic version as well.